Audi 200 kg

NM/S4 · 23-09-13, 08:28 AM

I'm new here and hoping to find specific information for the audi 200 with kg engine. I have a 85 audi kg engine. Looking to see if someone can post pics of their stock kg engine. Having issues and not sure of the breather system even after looking at diagrams. Car does not want to start, heater does not blow and widows do not work. If anybody can help with any of these issues it's much appreciated.

missfire · 23-09-13, 10:02 AM

Here's the blower motor change -

http://www.classic-audi.co.uk/forum/...=Heater+blower

I got the motor for about £90, it's the brushes and commutator ring that goes. Not difficult just a bit of a pain in the Rs!

Windows, haven't been in there yet but you remove the 'inner door', don't know what it's called but it includes the frame and glass, then you can get to the motor, open it up and I think some folk say cleaning and re-greasing them gets them going. The ones on mine that don't work are the ones which are never used, so that makes sense.

Breathers.. Don't have a KG! But it can't be that different to any other older 5pot turbo.

Brian83 · 23-09-13, 10:20 AM

I misread the post and thought you had a super light-weight audi!

Hanuman · 23-09-13, 02:00 PM

At the last count-
http://www.classic-audi.co.uk/forum/...t=27630&page=3

Your engine would start, if the open port in the manifold was blocked off.
(Things that I would check)
-air, breather, induction side has air leak(s)

It would stall, or try to, if you opened the throttle
(Things that I would check)
-fuel supply, or delivery
-Mixture

A few good photos of your engine engine bay would probably be more helpful, as people who are familiar are likely to see something that isn't right, whereas you are trying to get acquainted with the setup, not knowing if it is right.

NM/S4 · 24-09-13, 02:02 AM

Ok so I started this new thread cause the other thread was in the intro section. Looking for more help and thought I'd find it here in the tech section. After plugging and the port on the intakes manifold the car did start but ran like shit. Tries again a few days later and the car seems to NOT want to crank. It moves them does not turn over. So hoping these pics will help. And thanks real MSH for the tips. Will look into in the morning.

Breather setup. Runs from block to valve cover then over to the runner intake boot.

This is the open port on the intake manifold. It's on the back end.

I'm also missing the n75 valve. Or changeover valve? Can I use one from a 20v with no problems?

Found this today. It's on the back of the airbox and its open.

And what's the open hole on the fuel distributor

Hanuman · 24-09-13, 09:22 AM

Hole ringed in blue.

Mixture screw. Use a long 3mm hex Allen key for setting mixture at idle.

Hanuman · 24-09-13, 10:08 AM

Open port on top of the waste gate. Normally goes to vacuum somewhere before the turbo/inter cooler piping.. It is not a problem having it open to atmosphere, as this works as a 'servo' of sorts.

The main work in the waste gate is done with pressure acting below the diaphragm, to lift the wastegate, to control boost. The chamber on the other side of the diaphragm has the small connection on the cap- on my UR, I have this open. So do all of the UR-s4 that I have seen.

Is that connection crushed closed? If so, this may be a problem later.

A bigger concern is that the waste gate has several nuts missing. So, someone has been in there. But why?

Can you confirm if there is a cap in the middle of the waste gate cap, or is there an exposed Allen screw head?

Hanuman · 24-09-13, 10:27 AM

This is the basic layout of the breather system. Much of it can be disconnected/isolated initially, so that the induction side of the setup can be set correctly.

Item 10 is your idle stabilization valve. The silver cylinder in this pic.

Item 7 is a small non return valve. It is closed when the manifold has boost pressure, so the crank case does not get pressurized.
It is open when the manifold pressure drops, allowing crankcase gases to enter the manifold.

There must be something in here, or the two circuits must be isolated. I wonder if this it the reason for the open port on the manifold.

Hanuman · 24-09-13, 11:56 AM

Here's a 'silly*' question

Have you had the airfilter box open?
Looking at the engine bay, and with you being in N.M, it could be that you're struggling to pull enough air through a dust clogged filter.

*the only truly silly question is the one that wasn't asked!

Hanuman · 24-09-13, 12:09 PM

To demonstrate the point about the wastegate

This is from a UR-S4, but the principal is the same

The wastegate cap is held down by six nuts. The dirty white thing sticking out around the side is the diaphragm.
For proper operation, this diaphragm must be present and in good condition.

There is a large Banjo coupling on the side of the wastegate. This is pressurised, which results in the wastegate being opened as boost increases. In early UR, this was connected to exhaust gas from the exhaust manifold. Later models had this connected to the inlet manifold instead, but the principal is the same. As boost increases, the wastegate opens.

The cap on the wastegate has a small bore tube. In this pic, it is open to atmosphere. On my Ur, it is also open to atmosphere. In many audis, this is connected to a part of the induction system that is subject to a depression, or 'vacuum'. As long as it is not blocked, it should have little impact.

In the middle of the cap is a large screw, normally bonded with thread lock compound, and sealed with a plug. This sets the preload on the spring which is under the cap, holding the wastegate valve closed. if this has been tampered with, then the plug will be missing, and the screw can be turned (13mm allen key IIRC) if the load on the spring is too light, there will be less boost. if the load is too much, the car will overboost, and the built in protections will cut fuel to reduce boost.

23-09-13, 02:00 PM	#4
Hanuman Trickster Classic Audi Club Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Heckling from the cheap seats, Phnom Penh, KoW Posts: 7,026	At the last count- http://www.classic-audi.co.uk/forum/...t=27630&page=3 Your engine would start, if the open port in the manifold was blocked off. (Things that I would check) -air, breather, induction side has air leak(s) It would stall, or try to, if you opened the throttle (Things that I would check) -fuel supply, or delivery -Mixture A few good photos of your engine engine bay would probably be more helpful, as people who are familiar are likely to see something that isn't right, whereas you are trying to get acquainted with the setup, not knowing if it is right. __________________ I wish they would keep the damned Chinese away now that I can go home, so that I can enjoy Fish amok and a draught Angkor

24-09-13, 02:02 AM	#5
NM/S4 Grown up member Join Date: Aug 2013 Posts: 30	Audi 200 kg Ok so I started this new thread cause the other thread was in the intro section. Looking for more help and thought I'd find it here in the tech section. After plugging and the port on the intakes manifold the car did start but ran like shit. Tries again a few days later and the car seems to NOT want to crank. It moves them does not turn over. So hoping these pics will help. And thanks real MSH for the tips. Will look into in the morning. Breather setup. Runs from block to valve cover then over to the runner intake boot. This is the open port on the intake manifold. It's on the back end. I'm also missing the n75 valve. Or changeover valve? Can I use one from a 20v with no problems? Found this today. It's on the back of the airbox and its open. And what's the open hole on the fuel distributor Last edited by NM/S4; 24-09-13 at 09:29 AM.

24-09-13, 09:22 AM	#6
Hanuman Trickster Classic Audi Club Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Heckling from the cheap seats, Phnom Penh, KoW Posts: 7,026	Hole ringed in blue. Mixture screw. Use a long 3mm hex Allen key for setting mixture at idle. __________________ I wish they would keep the damned Chinese away now that I can go home, so that I can enjoy Fish amok and a draught Angkor Last edited by Hanuman; 24-09-13 at 10:18 AM.

24-09-13, 10:08 AM	#7
Hanuman Trickster Classic Audi Club Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Heckling from the cheap seats, Phnom Penh, KoW Posts: 7,026	Open port on top of the waste gate. Normally goes to vacuum somewhere before the turbo/inter cooler piping.. It is not a problem having it open to atmosphere, as this works as a 'servo' of sorts. The main work in the waste gate is done with pressure acting below the diaphragm, to lift the wastegate, to control boost. The chamber on the other side of the diaphragm has the small connection on the cap- on my UR, I have this open. So do all of the UR-s4 that I have seen. Is that connection crushed closed? If so, this may be a problem later. A bigger concern is that the waste gate has several nuts missing. So, someone has been in there. But why? Can you confirm if there is a cap in the middle of the waste gate cap, or is there an exposed Allen screw head? __________________ I wish they would keep the damned Chinese away now that I can go home, so that I can enjoy Fish amok and a draught Angkor Last edited by Hanuman; 24-09-13 at 10:15 AM.

24-09-13, 10:27 AM	#8
Hanuman Trickster Classic Audi Club Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Heckling from the cheap seats, Phnom Penh, KoW Posts: 7,026	This is the basic layout of the breather system. Much of it can be disconnected/isolated initially, so that the induction side of the setup can be set correctly. Item 10 is your idle stabilization valve. The silver cylinder in this pic. Item 7 is a small non return valve. It is closed when the manifold has boost pressure, so the crank case does not get pressurized. It is open when the manifold pressure drops, allowing crankcase gases to enter the manifold. There must be something in here, or the two circuits must be isolated. I wonder if this it the reason for the open port on the manifold. __________________ I wish they would keep the damned Chinese away now that I can go home, so that I can enjoy Fish amok and a draught Angkor

23-09-13, 10:02 AM	#2
missfire making wooden things Classic Audi Club Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: cow land Posts: 8,156	Here's the blower motor change - http://www.classic-audi.co.uk/forum/...=Heater+blower I got the motor for about £90, it's the brushes and commutator ring that goes. Not difficult just a bit of a pain in the Rs! Windows, haven't been in there yet but you remove the 'inner door', don't know what it's called but it includes the frame and glass, then you can get to the motor, open it up and I think some folk say cleaning and re-greasing them gets them going. The ones on mine that don't work are the ones which are never used, so that makes sense. Breathers.. Don't have a KG! But it can't be that different to any other older 5pot turbo.

23-09-13, 10:20 AM	#3
Brian83 Grown up member Classic Audi Club Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Loughborough & Lincoln Posts: 662	I misread the post and thought you had a super light-weight audi!

24-09-13, 11:56 AM	#9
Hanuman Trickster Classic Audi Club Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Heckling from the cheap seats, Phnom Penh, KoW Posts: 7,026	Here's a 'silly' question Have you had the airfilter box open? Looking at the engine bay, and with you being in N.M, it could be that you're struggling to pull enough air through a dust clogged filter. the only truly silly question is the one that wasn't asked! __________________ I wish they would keep the damned Chinese away now that I can go home, so that I can enjoy Fish amok and a draught Angkor Last edited by Hanuman; 24-09-13 at 12:28 PM.

24-09-13, 12:09 PM	#10
Hanuman Trickster Classic Audi Club Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Heckling from the cheap seats, Phnom Penh, KoW Posts: 7,026	To demonstrate the point about the wastegate This is from a UR-S4, but the principal is the same The wastegate cap is held down by six nuts. The dirty white thing sticking out around the side is the diaphragm. For proper operation, this diaphragm must be present and in good condition. There is a large Banjo coupling on the side of the wastegate. This is pressurised, which results in the wastegate being opened as boost increases. In early UR, this was connected to exhaust gas from the exhaust manifold. Later models had this connected to the inlet manifold instead, but the principal is the same. As boost increases, the wastegate opens. The cap on the wastegate has a small bore tube. In this pic, it is open to atmosphere. On my Ur, it is also open to atmosphere. In many audis, this is connected to a part of the induction system that is subject to a depression, or 'vacuum'. As long as it is not blocked, it should have little impact. In the middle of the cap is a large screw, normally bonded with thread lock compound, and sealed with a plug. This sets the preload on the spring which is under the cap, holding the wastegate valve closed. if this has been tampered with, then the plug will be missing, and the screw can be turned (13mm allen key IIRC) if the load on the spring is too light, there will be less boost. if the load is too much, the car will overboost, and the built in protections will cut fuel to reduce boost. __________________ I wish they would keep the damned Chinese away now that I can go home, so that I can enjoy Fish amok and a draught Angkor Last edited by Hanuman; 24-09-13 at 03:32 PM.